the devil came down to georgia...

Dory Berkowitz-Bukowski

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Pancake Wagon said:
WTF is this fair trade crap?

Not exactly crap. :rolleyes:

It means the farmers in the third world will actually get paid a decent wage. All us rich kids have to do is pay a few more cents for things like tea, chocolate or bananas and we're improving the standard of living in poorer places. I think it's a great idea, one of our supermarket chains has gotten big into ethical banking and fair trade. It's a step in the right direction. :)
 

Percy Thrillington

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NeedMoreEmo said:
Not exactly crap. :rolleyes:

It means the farmers in the third world will actually get paid a decent wage. All us rich kids have to do is pay a few more cents for things like tea, chocolate or bananas and we're improving the standard of living in poorer places. I think it's a great idea, one of our supermarket chains has gotten big into ethical banking and fair trade. It's a step in the right direction. :)




Ethical banking?
Fair trade?
That stuff will never go over in corperate america.
Unless someone can exploit it to make some fat cash.
 

Dory Berkowitz-Bukowski

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Forrest Dump said:
Ethical banking?
Fair trade?
That stuff will never go over in corperate america.
Unless someone can exploit it to make some fat cash.

Yeah well, I'm sure some of your Americans out there have a tiny bit of empathy. Ethical banking is basically a bank which has good morals and doesn't loan money to third world countrys for their arms race and to further their debt. The whole point of fair trade is that the people who produce the goods don't get exploited, if you don't see how that could go down well then I feel pretty bad for you. I think it's an awesome idea.
 

Percy Thrillington

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NeedMoreEmo said:
Yeah well, I'm sure some of your Americans out there have a tiny bit of empathy. Ethical banking is basically a bank which has good morals and doesn't loan money to third world countrys for their arms race and to further their debt. The whole point of fair trade is that the people who produce the goods don't get exploited, if you don't see how that could go down well then I feel pretty bad for you. I think it's an awesome idea.



I agree that its a good idea.
I just dont see such things happening in greedy coporate america.
But then Im a cynical bastard
 

Dory Berkowitz-Bukowski

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Forrest Dump said:
I agree that its a good idea.
I just dont see such things happening in greedy coporate america.
But then Im a cynical bastard

I'm a cynical bitch, but it works here. If the products were advertised in a good way Im sure a lot of moms would catch on to it being cool to buy fair trade goods. A lot of organic, fair trade etc. stuff here is now fashionable to buy because it makes you look like a nice person I guess. :)
 
S

smileynev

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Sounds like a load of shit. Instead of forcing the consumer to pay more, why don't the companies chip in instead.
 

Dory Berkowitz-Bukowski

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Pancake Wagon said:
Sounds like a load of shit. Instead of forcing the consumer to pay more, why don't the companies chip in instead.

:lol: Corporate America being Mr Nice Guy and helping out the tea farmers in Kenya? Yeah, when hell freezes over hippy. I think if the consumers turn their backs on the corporate machines and choose fair trade goods over mass produced, low paying to the third word goods then the companies will have to adopt a nicer image and actually stop exploiting people. The last thing they want is to lower their profits, so they'd have to adapt.
 
S

smileynev

Guest
NeedMoreEmo said:
:lol: Corporate America being Mr Nice Guy and helping out the tea farmers in Kenya? Yeah, when hell freezes over hippy. I think if the consumers turn their backs on the corporate machines and choose fair trade goods over mass produced, low paying to the third word goods then the companies will have to adopt a nicer image and actually stop exploiting people. The last thing they want is to lower their profits, so they'd have to adapt.
Fair trade sounds like a marketing gimmic. Its just another means through which corporations get your money. They make you feel good about your purchases.
 

Dory Berkowitz-Bukowski

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Pancake Wagon said:
Fair trade sounds like a marketing gimmic. Its just another means through which corporations get your money. They make you feel good about your purchases.

Or you could accept that some companies like the niche of being fair and not exploiting people, whilst still getting a profit. When companys have big ethical issues their profits go down, their brand loyalty is ruined and consumers lose confidence in them. I can't see that happening with any fair trade products, most of it is ordered by the supermarket directly from the farm, so it's fresher, nicer tasting and it makes dem africans all warm and fuzzy inside.
 

JAXvillain

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NeedMoreEmo said:
:lol: Corporate America being Mr Nice Guy and helping out the tea farmers in Kenya? Yeah, when hell freezes over hippy. I think if the consumers turn their backs on the corporate machines and choose fair trade goods over mass produced, low paying to the third word goods then the companies will have to adopt a nicer image and actually stop exploiting people. The last thing they want is to lower their profits, so they'd have to adapt.

companies are bound by their fiduciary responsibility to the shareholders to maximize profit
 

Dory Berkowitz-Bukowski

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why_ask_why said:
companies are bound by their fiduciary responsibility to the shareholders to maximize profit

Yeah no shit, but I think we're plenty pissed at corporations to turn our backs on them. Compassion and fair trading throughout the world is the way forward.
 
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smileynev

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NeedMoreEmo said:
Or you could accept that some companies like the niche of being fair and not exploiting people, whilst still getting a profit. When companys have big ethical issues their profits go down, their brand loyalty is ruined and consumers lose confidence in them. I can't see that happening with any fair trade products, most of it is ordered by the supermarket directly from the farm, so it's fresher, nicer tasting and it makes dem africans all warm and fuzzy inside.
how do you know that this extra few cents goes to the farmers? A niche is all they ever will be. Why should I pay more for a product when I have my own mouths to feed at home.
 

Dory Berkowitz-Bukowski

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Pancake Wagon said:
how do you know that this extra few cents goes to the farmers? A niche is all they ever will be. Why should I pay more for a product when I have my own mouths to feed at home.

Listen, I'm sure you're just so way more strung out that an African earning an average of about $1 a week and call me stupid but I don't mind about the extra 20cents I pay for my good, morally superior bananas. And hey call me doubly crazy but maybe fair trade is in someone else interest, as in, it's not a completely selfish thing and someone actually benefits from the bit of money I spend. :rolleyes:
 

Pandora

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NeedMoreEmo said:
Listen, I'm sure you're just so way more strung out that an African earning an average of about $1 a week and call me stupid but I don't mind about the extra 20cents I pay for my good, morally superior bananas. And hey call me doubly crazy but maybe fair trade is in someone else interest, as in, it's not a completely selfish thing and someone actually benefits from the bit of money I spend. :rolleyes:

I'm no economist, but ideally doesn't a free market eventually regulate itself. If a company is doing something bad wrong and consumers find out about it then the company looses sales and is forced to changed their business practice or parish. Just look at Martha Stewart. She did something bad, she lost business because of the negative attention. I promise she will be more careful with how she handles herself from now on!

If you force everyone onto some fair market structure then there is no completion which drives companies to improve. Why do anything better or more efficiently if a company can make the same about of money by continuing with the status-quo. It would kinda be like a monopoly right? You'd get mediocre product and no other alternatives, which is terrible for consumers! You end up with a depressed economy like most socialist countires.

Edit: Do we have any economists around here that knows about this kinda crap? ;)
 
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Dory Berkowitz-Bukowski

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Pandora said:
I'm no economist, but ideally doesn't a free market eventually regulate itself. If a company is doing something bad wrong and consumers find out about it then the company looses sales and is forced to changed their business practice or parish. Just look at Martha Stewart. She did something bad, she lost business because of the negative attention. I promise she will be more careful with how she handles herself from now on!

If you force everyone onto some fair market structure then there is no completion which drives companies to improve. Why do anything better or more efficiently if a company can make the same about of money by continuing with the status-quo. It would kinda be like a monopoly right? You'd get mediocre product and no other alternatives, which is terrible for consumers! You end up with a depressed economy like most socialist countires.

We don't have a free market. The WTO made sure Del Monte were the only company that could sell bananas to the UK, even though our country wanted to buy them from Jamaica for a higher price. Corporations suck and should pay the penalties for all their ethical faults. The fair trade market makes people realize that they can help give to charity by simply paying a few dollars more in their weekly shopping. Hell, I went food shopping for the family a while back with my own money and I brought fair trade things even though I had barely any money.

It's not forcing it onto anybody, the choice is still there. I just think a sense of moral duty will make a lot of people buy fair trade things, the products taste even better imo so I don't see why people would want to buy cheaper goods just for the sake of being cheap. If helping someone out and getting rid of some selfishness costs $0.10 Im all for it. Maybe you guys aren't big on organic food, but our country is really into al that hippy stuff now. And guess what, it's a lot more expensive for organic veg than it is for normal. With organic food you get better tasing food, less pesticides used and the workers on plantations get good working conditions. :)
 

Dory Berkowitz-Bukowski

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Pandora said:
Edit: Do we have any economists around here that knows about this kinda crap? ;)

I do economics. I'm not a good economist or anything but Ive studied world trade and businesses etc. I also do religious studies and lot of that is discussing ethics, your country comes up in a lot of the "evil" discussions, so I know a fair bit about the countries that should be named and shamed.
 

Pandora

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NeedMoreEmo said:
We don't have a free market. The WTO made sure Del Monte were the only company that could sell bananas to the UK, even though our country wanted to buy them from Jamaica for a higher price. Corporations suck and should pay the penalties for all their ethical faults. The fair trade market makes people realize that they can help give to charity by simply paying a few dollars more in their weekly shopping. Hell, I went food shopping for the family a while back with my own money and I brought fair trade things even though I had barely any money.

It's not forcing it onto anybody, the choice is still there. I just think a sense of moral duty will make a lot of people buy fair trade things, the products taste even better imo so I don't see why people would want to buy cheaper goods just for the sake of being cheap. If helping someone out and getting rid of some selfishness costs $0.10 Im all for it. Maybe you guys aren't big on organic food, but our country is really into al that hippy stuff now. And guess what, it's a lot more expensive for organic veg than it is for normal. With organic food you get better tasing food, less pesticides used and the workers on plantations get good working conditions. :)

Hmm... that's pretty interesting. I did not know that. :cool:

Yeah I like the fact that Starbucks is "morally conscience", which is part of the reason I like giving them my business. I'm willing to pay more for their coffee because of it, and because I happen to think it's damn good. :) I like buying products that have a portion of sales going to a charatable cause, like breast cancer research or something.

As long as people have options to choose from I think fair business like Starbucks are cool. If consumers what business to behave a cetain way then they need to put their money where they're mouth is. Too many people expect the government to do it for them and just encourage more government regulations.
 

Dory Berkowitz-Bukowski

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Pandora said:
Hmm... that's pretty interesting. I did not know that. :cool:

Yeah I like the fact that Starbucks is "morally conscience", which is part of the reason I like giving them my business. I'm willing to pay more for their coffee because of it, and because I happen to think it's damn good. :) I like buying products that have a portion of sales going to a charatable cause, like breast cancer research or something.

As long as people have options to choose from I think fair business like Starbucks are cool. If consumers what business to behave a cetain way then they need to put their money where they're mouth is. Too many people expect the government to do it for them and just encourage more government regulations.

Yeah well, with corporations like Del Monte etc. practising anti-competitive ways of buisness it would be hard to establish a free trade market in your country. Starbucks are doing a good thing, I think a while ago they said every 20p on the coffee we get goes to India or something. I forget but I thought it was nice. :)
 
J

jaxxor

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I saw the title and thought of this. It's on my myspace blog.

The Devil Went To The Toilet

The devil wandered into the DC
He was lookin for a bowl to smear
He was in a bind cos of a plugged behind
been drinkin' up all the beer
When he came across a young man
gruntin and sweatin on the pot
And the devil stopped his dump
And said, Boy, let me tell you what
I guess you didn't know
but I gotta pinch a loaf
And if you'd care to take a dare
I'll make a bet with you
Now you've made quite a pile there
But give the devil his due
I bet a toilet of gold against your soul
cos I vent logs bigger than you
The boy said My name's Jaxxor
And it might be a sin
But I'll take you bet, your gonna regret
Cause I'm the best that's ever been"

Jaxxor grab your colon
And spray the crapper hard
Cause hell's broke loose in the DC
And the devil's harvistin' tards
And if you win
You get this shiny toilet made of gold
But if you lose, the devil gets your soul

The devil spread his cheeks
And he said "I'll start this show"
And fire flew from his nether hole
As he centered on the bowl
And he leaned over and started boiling out
And it made a evil hiss
Then a band of demons joined in
And it sounded something like this
PFFTBLLLTPFFTVLLLTPFFTBLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLT

When the devil finished Jaxxor said
Well you're, pretty good old son
But sit down in that stall right there
And let me show you how it's done

Fire in the bathroom run boys run!
Jaxxor's shit blockin out the sun
a rectal blast lookin like dough
a fecal volcano that's ready to blow

The devil bowed his head
Because he knew that he'd been beat
And he laid that golden shitter
On the ground at jaxxor's feet
jaxxor said "Devil just come on back
If you think you can shit again
I done told you once you little FARGOT
I'm the best that's ever been"

Fire in the bathroom run boys run!
Jaxxor's shit blockin out the sun
a rectal blast lookin like dough
a fecal volcano that's ready to blow