wtf...someone just got shot in our building

BeerAd said:
Bringing a gun with you everyday to work though, to me, is uncalled for. Whether you agree or not a gun commands power and can be easily misused, sometimes the handler doesnt even notice. Although I would not sway my mindset if I knew someone was carrying, many people would. Sadly they would also treat you differently and you could use many people without even noticing. All because of their all so real fear of guns.
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Ok, but what is the point of owning a handgun, and have a permit to carry it, if you just leave it at home in your sock drawer instead of taking it to the place where you spend the second most amount of time.

I have very little moral/emotional association with the bulk of the people I work around. I say "around" because I don't work "with" a large portion of them. I work for a company that is big enough that I don't know everyone's names. I don't know most of their faces. I don't know who is screwing whose wife. I don't know what they drugs they do. I don't know any of that crap.

So ultimately what is the difference between me having a gun here and me having a gun at the mall?
 
Dysfunctional said:
Your presuppositions are staggering. Thank God the founding fathers had more faith in their fellow man; in your mind 'the people' are just the few you have faith in and everyone else is an idiot.

I grew up in place where all the 'idiots' had a loaded shotgun in their business and home. If I had $10, I could have bought a shotgun in the local hardware store when I was a minor. We carried our rifles to school for purposes of a rifle club.

It isn't really a different world today - just that the leftests have done a great sales job convincing the public that guns are bad and that most people who own them are nut jobs just waiting to go crazy and kill people.
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Honestly I would love to reply to this but I just don't enjoy talking to you, sorry.
 
Dysfunctional said:
Your presuppositions are staggering. Thank God the founding fathers had more faith in their fellow man; in your mind 'the people' are just the few you have faith in and everyone else is an idiot.

I grew up in place where all the 'idiots' had a loaded shotgun in their business and home. If I had $10, I could have bought a shotgun in the local hardware store when I was a minor. We carried our rifles to school for purposes of a rifle club.

It isn't really a different world today - just that the leftests have done a great sales job convincing the public that guns are bad and that most people who own them are nut jobs just waiting to go crazy and kill people.
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the majority of people don't hunt for food anymore and know jackshit about guns because of it...if I relied on my gun to eat, I'd be extremely skilled in it's use...we are no longer living under the tyranny of an overtly oppressive govt either so there's another reason people don't know how to use guns

so what good reasons are left for gun use in the general populace? yup, shooting people in disputes

I am in no way advocating that people who like guns disarm...do what you want just leave me out of it
 
KNYTE said:
Ok, but what is the point of owning a handgun, and have a permit to carry it, if you just leave it at home in your sock drawer instead of taking it to the place where you spend the second most amount of time.

I have very little moral/emotional association with the bulk of the people I work around. I say "around" because I don't work "with" a large portion of them. I work for a company that is big enough that I don't know everyone's names. I don't know most of their faces. I don't know who is screwing whose wife. I don't know what they drugs they do. I don't know any of that crap.

So ultimately what is the difference between me having a gun here and me having a gun at the mall?
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I think you missed the point that I was kinda getting at. As long as I do not ever see you carrying that gun, I wont know or care. The first time I see it hanging out you will have 2 choices dont bring it back or fired. If it is hanging out you are at fault and braking what your own beliefs are anyways. See what I am getting at?
 
BeerAd said:
you sir, are a very odd man. On a different note...

Well i was going to take a pic of my desktop to show your snowy wood photo but there is confidential stuff on there now :eek:
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I'm glad someone liked it. :D

Thorn Bird said:
so what about questionable situations. you see a person come in looking nervous and jumpy. you see him/her making nervous gestures with his/her hands or something. you THINK he/she MIGHT be attempting to do something simply because of questionable behavior. he/she is walking closer and closer to you, eyes darting around. what are you going to do? how far does a situation need to go before you use it?
the judgement of people, especially skiddish ones, lacks appeal. do you have a set of guidelines on when you feel it's right to pull the gun out and use it?
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Yes, it's called "the law." You cant shoot someone unless you are in FEAR OF YOUR LIFE/IN FEAR OF IMMINENT LETHAL FORCE where a REASONABLE person would be in fear of the same.

In most states you also have a duty to retreat before you can respond. In NY here, you have to not only be facing imminent lethal force, you have to exhaust ALL possible routes of escape. A friend of mine got probation because she fought back -after- being held down (it also applies for normal self defense), and therefore didnt fulfill the escape requirement. :(
 
Thorn Bird said:
so what about questionable situations. you see a person come in looking nervous and jumpy. you see him/her making nervous gestures with his/her hands or something. you THINK he/she MIGHT be attempting to do something simply because of questionable behavior. he/she is walking closer and closer to you, eyes darting around. what are you going to do? how far does a situation need to go before you use it?

the judgement of people, especially skiddish ones, lacks appeal. do you have a set of guidelines on when you feel it's right to pull the gun out and use it?
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You bring up a good point, but the reality is that IF something happens I most likely will be REacting to it, not acting against it.

No matter how much time I put into being aware the likelyhood of something going down and me not be aware of it prior is just substantially higher. I could watch everyone around me with as much focus as I could gather and still miss the guy who pulls a shotgun from out of nowhere and starts shooting.

I'm not saying your point is a non-issue, because it most certainly is not, but I do not think that I would ever have to have the conscious thought "I'd better pull my gun on this guy".

BeerAd said:
I think you missed the point that I was kinda getting at. As long as I do not ever see you carrying that gun, I wont know or care. The first time I see it hanging out you will have 2 choices dont bring it back or fired. If it is hanging out you are at fault and braking what your own beliefs are anyways. See what I am getting at?
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So basically, according to what you just said, you'd be fine with me banging your woman, as long as you didn't know. You'd be fine with me stealing your money, as long as you didn't know. Is that about accurate? You can't have a firm stance on something that is governed by whether or not you are aware of it. You either feel strongly about something all of the time, or you don't feel strongly about it.
 
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BeerAd said:
To bring it back to the original post...

Do you feel that more people shooting in this situation would have made things better?
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ahahaha..there were a few 100 people around too...so a chain reaction would have occurred of people drawing and shooting who they thought was the perp :fly: yike
 
w_a_w said:
if it's my day to die, so be it...I will not live my life in fear nor will I arm to the teeth
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I am quoting this because I feel the same way. If Knyte and Dysfunc want to get into a gun fight one day I will grab WaW and we will be over at the bar having one last beer.
 
w_a_w said:
ahahaha..there were a few 100 people around too...so a chain reaction would have occurred of people drawing and shooting who they thought was the perp :fly: yike
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Honestly you are the only one able to answer that question because you were there. In a situation like this I see total chaos from a 100 people trying to defend themselves with guns.
 
BeerAd said:
To bring it back to the original post...

Do you feel that more people shooting in this situation would have made things better?
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That really wasnt the original point. She obviously coud've done more to help herself than get shot. Then w_a_w went a his pinko commie rant about guns in the workplace kekeke
 
Great points though Knyte, WaW, Thorny, FG and everyone

very good conversation on each side of things. The avid gun user, the neutrals, the moms, the weirdos :p
 
FlamingGlory said:
That really wasnt the original point. She obviously coud've done more to help herself than get shot.
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My feelings exactly. Defending herself doesn't necessarily mean carrying a gun or relying on other civilians who happened to be carrying guns.

BeerAd said:
I am quoting this because I feel the same way. If Knyte and Dysfunc want to get into a gun fight one day I will grab WaW and we will be over at the bar having one last beer.
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I read a pistol combat instructional book recently and one of the things that stuck with me more than anything else was this statement...

"In 10 years no one will remember the guns used, the circumstances of why it started, or where it even happened, people will only remember who lived, and who died."
 
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FlamingGlory said:
That really wasnt the original point. She obviously coud've done more to help herself than get shot. Then w_a_w went a his pinko commie rant about guns in the workplace kekeke
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Yeah but by saying "she" should have been carrying you are basically saying everyone there should have been. Panic can be a very scary thing when its grouped in the masses.
 
w_a_w, does your work outlaw pocket knives? Or, as Sarcasmo said, scissors? What about the blade on a paper cutter? That can be a pretty good weapon too.
 
KNYTE said:
My feelings exactly. Defending herself doesn't necessarily mean carrying a gun or relying on other civilians who happened to be carrying guns.
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I dont think anyone really wants to believe they are about to die and it might not even of hit her until the bullet did.

A read a pistol combat instructional manual recently and one of the things that stuck with me more than anything else was this statement...

"In 10 years no one will remember the guns used, the circumstances of why it started, or where it even happened, people will only remember who lived, and who died."
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Thx, I enjoyed that quote, very realistic.
 
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