So I hate Bush, but pulling out of Iraq seems like a bad idea. v.tellmewhyimwrong
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Sp`ange
Flaccid Member
Sarcasmo said:
We did a half-assed job with Afghanistan helping them fight the Russians. Al Queida came from that training.
SpangeMonkee said:
Al Qaeda isn't exactly a top-notch fighting force. It's easy to make explosives and fill cars with them. It's easy blow yourself up in a restaurant. It's easy to kidnap people and cut their heads off and videotape it to scare people. And it's also easy to look like an average arabic guy in an average arabic country without a special uniform to give away your Al Qaeda status. Retarded monkeys could do this stuff. Nothing they do is amazing or tactical or ingenious. American gang members do the same shit every day, sans explosives.
It just so happens there's no real defense against random acts of violence.
Force the entire country to walk around naked. That'll stop a lot of the suicide bombers.Sarcasmo said:
I love how 'Liberal' and 'Conservative' have taken on a rather different connotation of recent. They have now become slogans in the political battle of morons without much reference to the way in which they are formally/meant to be used. For example, Liberal is now an insult directed at people who are "Soft on Commies" or Pro-Human rights whereas Conservatism itslef is now a sought after 'badge' for 'intellectuals' who wish to emphasise the fact that they are traditionalists or conservatives and that they believe solidly in American tradition. Far from it, these right-wing radicals and thier thinking is far outside the framework of American tradition and anything but conservative of American values. No doubt these numpties claim to be the only "True" Americans though.
This thread needs more hooting and hollering
This thread needs more hooting and hollering
Hasn't that happened many times throughout history?
Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if it is all a matter of perspective. Looking back it makes sense and has meaning to call someone conservative or not. At the present, it is pointless. And always has been.
Actually, I wouldn't be surprised if it is all a matter of perspective. Looking back it makes sense and has meaning to call someone conservative or not. At the present, it is pointless. And always has been.
Iraq would have eventually have happened because the possibility of terrorism going there if Osama was ever found so us going there was good. However, two things are bad. 1. the timeing kind of sucked since we really didnt accomplish much in Afganistan. Yes we did help them out, but it was the secondary motive. Osama will be like OJ's hunt for the real killers, it will go on forever until its obvious that hes dead because we haven't heard from him in years or he makes a major mistake.
The second problem was that for the most part no one tried to educate the American public that this was going to take years if not decades to complete. I bet if you went around when we first started bombing most people thought it was going to be a year tops like Desert Storm and Shield. We are used to getting our way immediately and can't think about how someone will react to being oppressed for their entire life and then given freedom. No one thought about rehabilitation.
The second problem was that for the most part no one tried to educate the American public that this was going to take years if not decades to complete. I bet if you went around when we first started bombing most people thought it was going to be a year tops like Desert Storm and Shield. We are used to getting our way immediately and can't think about how someone will react to being oppressed for their entire life and then given freedom. No one thought about rehabilitation.
zengirl said:
Did you miss this part?
And the President has A LOT more power than you seem to think...
Sp`ange
Flaccid Member
Sarcasmo said:
the training that the Afghanis got was a)make-shift bombs b)gun fighting strategies c)organization d)utlizing resources.
something you have to understand is that most people don't know how and when to attack someone or how military groups operate. the basics can go a long way to turn a group of people into a militia.
Ryokurin said:
You aren't suggesting that there was a link between Iraq and al Queda, are you?
Exactly. Nation building takes years, and we really suck at it.
No, I wasn't saying that there was a link between Iraq and al Queda but it would have been a logical place for it to go if it was ran out of Afganistan. Most of that is our fault too for not doing what we are doing now 15 years ago. We have a bad habit of starting stuff, getting bored or afraid when people start dieing and pulling out. Its almost like we go on purpose to fuck with people heads and way of life.
What I was pointing out is that we did the same thing again, Went and bombed the hell out of Afganistan in the name of finding Bin Ladin and then after making a mark there stormed down to Iraq. Yes I know we still have people there, but seriously has anyone heard anything about progress or what they are doing? Hell, even in Iraq the only thing we hear now is when someone dies. Unless you personally know somone there you dont have a clue on what they are doing in either place.
What I was pointing out is that we did the same thing again, Went and bombed the hell out of Afganistan in the name of finding Bin Ladin and then after making a mark there stormed down to Iraq. Yes I know we still have people there, but seriously has anyone heard anything about progress or what they are doing? Hell, even in Iraq the only thing we hear now is when someone dies. Unless you personally know somone there you dont have a clue on what they are doing in either place.
I think a lot of the reason we don't have a clue what is going on, is that we don't trust the White House to tell us any more. There was a report on NPR where even some Republicans were having a hard time defending some of the information we've been getting recently regarding the efforts over there.