GAY RELUBRICANTS Where are you now? lulz

OzSTEEZ

¡ɟɟo ʞɔnɟ ʇunɔ 'ᴉO
Nov 11, 2008
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Oz
I guess it comes down to whether you will take word of mouth as enough evidence to believe.
 

Duke

. . first name's "Daisy" boys
May 12, 2008
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And I have trouble with that.

So, if your house was broken into, and the thieves left no fingerprints, no trace, and all there was is your neighbor saying 'I saw who did it', you would then have trouble allowing him to sit in court and testify against those he accused of breaking in?
 

Duke

. . first name's "Daisy" boys
May 12, 2008
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Extreme example, to be sure, but you are making the distinction of which testimony is allowable, and which isn't. The end point is, there is actually more evidence that God does exist, than there is evidence that he doesn't. The evidence that he doesn't exist is based solely on the fact that people don't believe the testimonials over the past thousands of years that he does.
 

OzSTEEZ

¡ɟɟo ʞɔnɟ ʇunɔ 'ᴉO
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Oz
So, if your house was broken into, and the thieves left no fingerprints, no trace, and all there was is your neighbor saying 'I saw who did it', you would then have trouble allowing him to sit in court and testify against those he accused of breaking in?


I guess not, but that still doesn't prove who broke into my house. Could my neighbour be lying?
 
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OzSTEEZ

¡ɟɟo ʞɔnɟ ʇunɔ 'ᴉO
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Oz
Extreme example, to be sure, but you are making the distinction of which testimony is allowable, and which isn't. The end point is, there is actually more evidence that God does exist, than there is evidence that he doesn't. The evidence that he doesn't exist is based solely on the fact that people don't believe the testimonials over the past thousands of years that he does.

Is there not proof of Evolution? Does that not contradict the word of the bible of which Christians use to claim proof of God. That's like your neighbour testifying that he knows who broke into your house, and then you come to find out that your neighbour is a compulsive liar. Now what?
 

OzSTEEZ

¡ɟɟo ʞɔnɟ ʇunɔ 'ᴉO
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Oz
Could be. But without evidence or testimony that would give you cause to believe he is lying, it would not follow logic to automatically assume he is.

But it would not be the ultimate determining factor because it is not concrete.


The factor we use to determine guilt, and the factors we use to determine the existence of an almighty God which people want everyone to submit to, are different.
 

Duke

. . first name's "Daisy" boys
May 12, 2008
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Is there not proof of Evolution? Does that not contradict the word of the bible of which Christians use to claim proof of God. That's like your neighbour testifying that he knows who broke into your house, and then you come to find out that your neighbour is a compulsive liar. Now what?

The proof and belief of a god, a supreme being, dates back far before the Bible, or Christianity. To make this an argument based on a singular religion would be limiting a scope. The belief in a supreme being predates the written word.

To use the Bible as the sole evidence of the existence of a god, and to try to debunk it, is like saying 'if the glove doesn't fit, you must acquit', even though you are trying to fit a no dried out leather glove over a latex glove in the first place.
 

OzSTEEZ

¡ɟɟo ʞɔnɟ ʇunɔ 'ᴉO
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Oz
The proof and belief of a god, a supreme being, dates back far before the Bible, or Christianity. To make this an argument based on a singular religion would be limiting a scope. The belief in a supreme being predates the written word.

To use the Bible as the sole evidence of the existence of a god, and to try to debunk it, is like saying 'if the glove doesn't fit, you must acquit', even though you are trying to fit a no dried out leather glove over a latex glove in the first place.

Ok, I understand that. Yet does not the proof of evolution play into this heavily?
 

JAXvillain

Curly_Sue
Oct 13, 2004
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a lot of the stories in the bible date back 1000's of years before christianity and were adaptations of older roman and greek polytheistic tales. it's very loosely based historical fiction at best
 

Duke

. . first name's "Daisy" boys
May 12, 2008
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Ok, I understand that. Yet does not the proof of evolution play into this heavily?

Not really. Evolution is a Judeo-Christian thing. Every religion across the world has their own beliefs on a supreme being, and how the earth and the people on it came to be. Same thing that each of those religions have their own view of the afterlife, and most have a view of the end of days.

What is binding between them is that almost every culture, independent of association via trade, travel, commerce, or communication, across the planet has, in their own way, come to believe in a supreme entity or entities. Independently. That's not a massive conspiracy. That's just plain fact. And it's been happening since, at least, recorded history has been uncovered, and even before based upon ruins and relics predating the discovery of writing.

That's a large amount of people, over a long amount of time. While you can say 'they could very well be lying', or 'they don't know any better', one can also counter that it's a pretty large sample of humanity, from every culture across the globe, from many different civilizations throughout time, to just simply discount and not take into evidence that there might be something to the belief of a higher being.

And, I'm willing to go on a limb here and say, it's probably a bit more evidence, both heresay, testimony, and otherwise, than there is disproving the same existence of a higher power.
 

Duke

. . first name's "Daisy" boys
May 12, 2008
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Sorry, let me add that Evolution isn't Judeo-Christian. It counters the core beliefs of 'some' sects of christianity. Not all. We've discussed this before that Evolution isn't globally discounted by all groups of christianity, just some of the more vocal and extremely conservative types who adhere strictly to the bible.

Creationism is the Judeo-Christian concept, obviously. But there are a lot of Christians who don't believe in creationism as a whole.
 

Duke

. . first name's "Daisy" boys
May 12, 2008
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Besides, the belief in a higher power isn't negated by the fact that life evolved. It really comes down to what your belief in that higher power is based on.

My personal belief comes from the fact that, in a macrocosmic view, the universe is just way to orderly. And there is just too much commonality between how an atom works, and how a solar system works, and how a universe works, for it to be just written off as cause that it's all coincidence.
 

OzSTEEZ

¡ɟɟo ʞɔnɟ ʇunɔ 'ᴉO
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Oz
Not really. Evolution is a Judeo-Christian thing. Every religion across the world has their own beliefs on a supreme being, and how the earth and the people on it came to be. Same thing that each of those religions have their own view of the afterlife, and most have a view of the end of days.

What is binding between them is that almost every culture, independent of association via trade, travel, commerce, or communication, across the planet has, in their own way, come to believe in a supreme entity or entities. Independently. That's not a massive conspiracy. That's just plain fact. And it's been happening since, at least, recorded history has been uncovered, and even before based upon ruins and relics predating the discovery of writing.

That's a large amount of people, over a long amount of time. While you can say 'they could very well be lying', or 'they don't know any better', one can also counter that it's a pretty large sample of humanity, from every culture across the globe, from many different civilizations throughout time, to just simply discount and not take into evidence that there might be something to the belief of a higher being.

And, I'm willing to go on a limb here and say, it's probably a bit more evidence, both heresay, testimony, and otherwise, than there is disproving the same existence of a higher power.

So instead of having one witness to my house being broken into, I now have 100 witnesses. Unfortunately all the witnesses have different testimonies. One says the guy was black, one say the guy was white. One says the intruder was 7 foot tall, another says he was a midget. One says the intruder had wings and flew around the house a few times, another says he came out of the ground.

Who to believe? Or should you believe any of them?