Marriage is a construct of the church and shouldn't be handled by the government in the first place, straight or gay. All state recognized couples should be civil unions, period.
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- Thread starter dbzeag
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Marriage is a construct of the church and shouldn't be handled by the government in the first place, straight or gay. All state recognized couples should be civil unions, period.
And most gay people would agree, they're not after marriage for the title they're after marriage for the legal entitlements that comes with it.
That's where the debate really is.
w3rd
Not everyone agrees on those basic human rights, however. Not many agree that keeping 100% of the money I work for until I decide it should be taxed is a basic human right (self ownership). Not everyone agrees that being able to keep and bear whatever weapons I so choose is a basic human right (self defense).
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eileenbunny
Druish Princess
Okay, listen to me Dave. You do complain about the state of things in Ohio. You have a very defeatist attitude about it all. Not only do you complain about gay rights, but you also complain about the state of the economy in Cleveland. You have chosen the option of rolling over and sobbing about it all. It effects your life, it makes you more miserable, and you do notice it. You've talked to me about it on more than one occasion.
I've been trying to help for as long as I have been in Ohio, but I'm leaving. So here's what you can do. Join Equality Ohio http://eqfed.org/equalityohio/home.html. They work with the Human Rights Campaign and have a very specific 10 year plan to make things better for you and every other GLBT person in Ohio and the US. They need help to do this and they make it easy. They send out action alerts and all you have to do is sign up and show up. Dedicate a little bit of your time to this cause and it might help. At least learn a little about it.
Part of their plan is to convince a large number of people that they are right. Another part is to make sure that the people in legislative offices in Ohio are sympathetic to their cause. THIS IS WHY VOTING IS IMPORTANT!!! If Ken Blackwell had won the governors seat you could kiss any hope goodbye, but Ted Strickland is a guy who might actually help you. Fortunately Strickland won. Fortunately Dewine is no longer our senator too.
Furthermore, if you want things to change in Cleveland, perhaps learning a little about the economy, what kinds of things attract new businesses and people to Ohio, and which legislators have a good plan for all of this might be important.
I know you don't feel like taking the time to do this, but I'm tired of hearing you complain about stuff that really DOES effect you and not seeing why politics is important for changing some of it.
I've been trying to help for as long as I have been in Ohio, but I'm leaving. So here's what you can do. Join Equality Ohio http://eqfed.org/equalityohio/home.html. They work with the Human Rights Campaign and have a very specific 10 year plan to make things better for you and every other GLBT person in Ohio and the US. They need help to do this and they make it easy. They send out action alerts and all you have to do is sign up and show up. Dedicate a little bit of your time to this cause and it might help. At least learn a little about it.
Part of their plan is to convince a large number of people that they are right. Another part is to make sure that the people in legislative offices in Ohio are sympathetic to their cause. THIS IS WHY VOTING IS IMPORTANT!!! If Ken Blackwell had won the governors seat you could kiss any hope goodbye, but Ted Strickland is a guy who might actually help you. Fortunately Strickland won. Fortunately Dewine is no longer our senator too.
Furthermore, if you want things to change in Cleveland, perhaps learning a little about the economy, what kinds of things attract new businesses and people to Ohio, and which legislators have a good plan for all of this might be important.
I know you don't feel like taking the time to do this, but I'm tired of hearing you complain about stuff that really DOES effect you and not seeing why politics is important for changing some of it.
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Or, to completely over generalize this very good post...
Be a responsible citizen.
You also did your part, of which I am envious, of moving out of the state. I am currently looking into an option to work abroad for a couple of years with my company. We are looking into the feasibility of such a venture now.
I cannot bring new businesses to Ohio or Cleveland for that matter, but I can support the ones that are left. Or I can at least go to the ones that I want to thrive. I spend as little time in Cleveland because unless a nuclear explosion happens or some other major change, it will not get better. My voting or putting a suggestion in the mayor's suggestion box is not going to cut it. Hell the US government can't even get Ohio who has been criminally charged for unconstitutionally funding schools for over a decade now to change their tax and distribution policies.
If this organization has a 10 year plan to make everyone aware of situations of human injustice and unequality, why is it I have never heard of them before, nor heard of any of their "rallies"? I support the local GLBT charters here in Cleveland by going to fundraisers and some events. It is no surprise that the only people that go to such events are the people that already have the right idea. It is the people that don't already have the right idea that need to be a part of such events.
The main thing I worry about (and which won't happen any time soon) is that I would be harmed physically or financially in some way because someone determined I am different and therefore should be "punished".
I am not saying politics is not important. I just see only 5% of the issues effect me daily. I don't know what politics does, and those in the offices only do. Politics gets groups of people moving in some direction. I guess I would just rather sit down and bitch about it instead, which is not the original topic of the thread. I shouldn't have even started this thread seeing as I didn't even vote.
Really? Every time I've written, I've gotten a hand signed (by someone) letter back.
You complain about Ohio constantly and can only see 5% of issues that could affect you? I don't t'hink I only hear you complkain about 5% of the time.
Yep, I've received nothing. Since I know the congressman's wife I asked her about it, and she gave me the usual line about the office being swamped with work and whatnot. It's just irritating to write a letter expressing your concerns and justifications for such concerns to receive nothing, not even an acknowledgment, in return.
It's not like it costs them anything to send me a letter.
Marriage isnt a right. Equal protection is though. Let's examine strict scrutiny equal protection:
One would have to say that the marriage law deprives them of the ability to marry. By limiting couples to ones of the opposite sex the state is not treating one class of people differently, women and men are treated the same; they are permitted to marry people of the opposite sex, but not people of their own sex.
So no sex discrimination.
The justification is of course that the government has a compelling interest in fostering relationships that prodice children.
I can go on...
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I lived across from them for the vast majority of my life. I played fort in the tree house in their backyard with their son whenever I could. Hell, even when we were both in high school we'd still hang out even though we went to different schools (he went to a magnet sci/math school). It's not like I just randomly showed up and bugged the Congressman's wife out of nowhere.