Political Correctness & the Stifling of Political Debate

Galen

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Nov 25, 2004
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I am firm in my belief that this place needs a good debate thread once in a while. I am sick to death of bullshit religion "debates" involving two idiots bantering about people forcing beliefs onto them. I couldn't give a fuck about that, if you're dumb enough to be subdued by someone performing a recruitment task, you shouldn't really be complaining about your ineptness to debate it with them face to face.

And that leads me to this thread. The retreat of the modern debate. I seen in a thread recently ZRH's comment about when you first meet a person, the cardinal rule is not to discuss politics. Why is this? Is it okay for people to harbour inappropriate beliefs? Are you afraid of being tarred a "radical" because you disagree with your country's policy on "tabboo" subjects like immigration or pandering to specific ethnic groups in return for votes?

When I ever attempt to raise any point of discussion with most of my friends, or anyone for that matter, I am often met with an almost universally intolerant and intellectually dishonest response by people who prefer political correctness over factual correctness. On subjects such as HIV/AIDS for instance, or the fact that kids are running feral in the streets robbing and mugging.

I can understand the my reasoning towards the continuing spiraling out of control of HIV/AIDS for most people will be an emotional one. Perhaps they know people who have suffered from this horrible disease. But emotion should never overtake factual reasoning, you can't wrap everything in cotton-wool forever. It's also a highly sensitive subject. Somewhere, deep rooted in all our brains we know that the main reason for the insane growth of the virus is due to African migration. People, leaving Africa, coming here and being diagnosed with HIV. But are we willing to accept it? No, Clearly, in most people’s minds, this theory couldn’t be true—everyone knew the increase in HIV was because of complacent and promiscuous teenagers. Right?

And so I hand it to you, Chairman. Is the current climate of Political Correctness stymying our love of political and socioeconomic debate through fear of offending other people involved? Or is it a good thing to candy-coat the facts?

Take it away.
 
SpangeMonkee said:
I'm never politically correct.

The term I hate the most is "African American". Wtf is that shit all about? That's why I check "Other" on all forms. If there was a place for European American, I would check that instead.
Can't really say anything against that. They still call them black here, on TV, newspapers etc.
 
Galen said:
I can understand the my reasoning towards the continuing spiraling out of control of HIV/AIDS for most people will be an emotional one. Perhaps they know people who have suffered from this horrible disease. But emotion should never overtake factual reasoning, you can't wrap everything in cotton-wool forever. It's also a highly sensitive subject. Somewhere, deep rooted in all our brains we know that the main reason for the insane growth of the virus is due to African migration. People, leaving Africa, coming here and being diagnosed with HIV. But are we willing to accept it? No, Clearly, in most people’s minds, this theory couldn’t be true—everyone knew the increase in HIV was because of complacent and promiscuous teenagers. Right?

Do you also blame them for the evolution of humans too? Are you sure they have determined ground zero for the virus? It certainly could have evolved anywhere on the planet...

And so I hand it to you, Chairman. Is the current climate of Political Correctness stymying our love of political and socioeconomic debate through fear of offending other people involved? Or is it a good thing to candy-coat the facts?

Take it away.

I think future people will look back on this PC era with disdain. I don't think its possible for anyone to argue for it. It's like arguing that it was a good idea for the British Redcoats to just stand there and be shot, rather than resort to the terrorist tactics used by the Americans.
 
fly said:
Do you also blame them for the evolution of humans too? Are you sure they have determined ground zero for the virus? It certainly could have evolved anywhere on the planet...
Eh? Looks like someone is interperating what I said as being racist or having something against africans.

I have nothing against them, let them do what people have been doing for centuries, but they are the reason of the HIV/AIDS explosion. Sure it "could have" evolved elsewhere, but it didn't. It evolved in Africa and spread with their movement, not with kids having sex.
 
Galen said:
Eh? Looks like someone is interperating what I said as being racist or having something against africans.

I have nothing against them, let them do what people have been doing for centuries, but they are the reason of the HIV/AIDS explosion. Sure it "could have" evolved elsewhere, but it didn't. It evolved in Africa and spread with their movement, not with kids having sex.
Somewhat veiled, I guess my point was 'why blame anyone'? What good does that do? To blame the African continent just seems pointless, so I could see how it would come across as racist. Especially since its unlikely that it was even trasnmitted outside of Africa by Africans, as probably 99% of them never leave their own country...

Should we blame Asia for avian flu?
 
fly said:
Somewhat veiled, I guess my point was 'why blame anyone'? What good does that do? To blame the African continent just seems pointless, so I could see how it would come across as racist.

Should we blame Asia for avian flu?
Perhaps I should explain the blaming.

A recent report about the explosion of AIDS in the past few years prompted the majority of newspapers and broadcasting establishments here to cover it, only they put it down to promiscuity and unprotected sex. That is a total falsehood. I'm not putting it down to Africans "spreading" AIDS, but with the increase of migration of them to the UK, they're bringing HIV with them which then in turn shows up on their migrant health check. No effort is made for them not to spread the disease thereafter.

Don't let this thread turn into a discussion about AIDS/HIV, it's about PC.
 
Then I'll let it die, but its hard to argue for PC. That's part of being PC, everyone says they are against it, yet still do it and want to hear it.

The AIDS debate could go on forever tho. :p
 
fly said:
Then I'll let it die, but its hard to argue for PC. That's part of being PC, everyone says they are against it, yet still do it and want to hear it.

The AIDS debate could go on forever tho. :p
That's a good point, but honestly, some people have defended it to me before. It's only a matter of time before policy is shaped by political correctness. I have a feeling Labour might start instituting them soon over here, that's why I'm shooting the crow and getting the fuck out.

I would be livid if sharia law ever entered the statute books in any form.
 
Galen said:
A super fact like that requires to be nitpicked, otherwise why post it?
afaik, its simply your t-cell count that determines if its HIV/AIDS. I don't see why that matters, so I must be wrong too. Enlighten us.

edit: Just checked wikipedia. It appears that I did know. :D
 
fly said:
afaik, its simply your t-cell count that determines if its HIV/AIDS. I don't see why that matters, so I must be wrong too. Enlighten us.
You can find out in wikipedia, this is a PC discussion, not a HIV/AIDS discussion.
 
Galen said:
You can find out in wikipedia, this is a PC discussion, not a HIV/AIDS discussion.
Youre the one that asked the question about it. I was just trying to figure out why it mattered.

And I did check it out. I was right. :p
 
Back on topic, how would you argue for and rationalize PC. I can't wait to hear what taeric has to say tomorrow (or some time this week)