ITT: We discuss religion's effects on behavior.

Sarcasmo

A Taste Of Honey Fluff Boy
Mar 28, 2005
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(Long post ahead)

I want your opinions and scientific judgments. I'm in the middle of a debate with 4 or 5 other people. It started innocently enough, by discussing this article. To quickly quote part of the article:

"...belief in and worship of God are not only unnecessary for a healthy society but may actually contribute to social problems.

The study counters the view of believers that religion is necessary to provide the moral and ethical foundations of a healthy society."


The person who posted the article is an atheist, which is important because his views offer an obviously different perspective from the dozen or so religous people who instantly flamed him. The article, while clearly about as arbitrary and ridiculously vague as it comes, got me thinking though, and somehow everyone got off on the tangent of whether it causes people to do things or not. I contended that religion does in fact directly (and this is the key) affect people's behavior and decisions.

Most people then flamed me as well, several said I was stupid, and one guy even went so far as to proclaim me the biggest idiot on Earth, saying that religion doesn't cause anything, it's the people who make their own decisions to do what they do. Both are sort of half-truths, I guess. People are certainly accountable for what they do, but religion makes things complicated.

The concept of religion is this: somebody somewhere got up one day and said "This is what I believe, and I want others to believe the same thing." That's it. A religion is born. It's a political institution at it's most fundamental level.

And you cannot tell people "This is what's right, and this is what's wrong", which is precisely what religions do, without those same people feeding on that message and turning around and using it to irrationally judge others. It's technically just a formalized system of prejudice.

Family units do much the same thing, but family units also employ common sense and hands-on observation, something that an institution based on the fervent belief in the unseeable and unknowable clearly lack on the surface. And in family units that message comes from just your mom and/or dad. In religion it comes from the almighty creator of every single thing that will ever fuckin' exist, and that's a pretty powerful motivator. Mom, or ALMIGHTY GOD? *insert thunderclap here*

The point is this: a person who is a lunatic is just a nutbag. A person who is a lunatic and has religion is a very zealous nutbag. While religion isn't the physical cause (no book or words on a page can force someone to wage war or be hateful) it compounds the problem.

Of course the most obvious example would be muslim extremism, since it's in the news almost every minute of every day, and has been since 9/11. If you take those kids out of those madrassahs, and away from the Koran and it's teachings, you get.....kids. Now they may grow up and do drugs and steal cars and get involved with drive-by shootings and whatnot, but they will just be kids, driven by their impulses and not those of the religion Mohammed decided to create because he got bored one day. Religion gives people beliefs and ideals that they may not otherwise have had, and behave in ways they may otherwise not have behaved.

(Which is exactly what drugs do, coincidentally.)

Then, to hopefully prove my point, I posted the following hypothetical scientific question: If religion, in all its shapes, beliefs, and contrivances, were to completely vanish from the face of the earth, would people behave differently for better or for worse? It would be like you are an observer, looking down at the world. One day religion is there, as it always has been, and the next it's gone, and it's like it had never been. No one knows anything about God or religion or an afterlife or anything else remotely religious. It's just gone, with no memory of it.

How would peoples' behavior be different on the two days?

If there is a change, does that mean religion is a catalyst?




Do you think religion can be blamed for the cause of many of the world's problems, or would people still hate and kill each other, simply for other reasons? Religion, like politics, fascinates me so I thought I'd try and get some conversation going that's a bit headier than usual.

And as an added bonus I give you this wondrous gem of inspiration.
 
I think that religion very much affects the way people behave. For example, things that others do regularly with no thought about, I think of as "mistakes" or "bad" things because of my religion and the way I've been taught. I believe that without religion the world would be worse, of course no one would hate others for their religions, but they would definitely hate them for other reasons.

Unfortunately religion also cause people to be judgemental, but that is a problem with being human, not with religion itself (unless that particular religion tells you to judge every one that's different from you).
 
I sure does directly affect people's behavior, even the hypocrites - since they're more likely to be vocal against someone else's actions/inactions

What is interesting is urban settings, where (if you leave out the college students and yuppies) there is strong religious presence, you should see the sheer number of people that attend the local Boston churches, and at the same time those neighborhoods are RIFE with criminal activity from those within.
 
Religion is just like any thing in life that involves others, a potential mind virus. For some reason for every thing in your life something triggered your thought or your future direction. For instance, maybe one day when I was very young I sat in front of a Apple II and thought that it was so cool that it influenced my like of computers now. Or theacoustican probably ran into a guy with an incredible sound system once and got him hooked. Just like there was something that occured that influenced that group of people to form a cult or that guy to kill himself.

The point is, most of your thoughts are because of circumstances beyound your control and in most cases there is a reason why you think the way that you do. Theres less freethought than you think.
 
I hate the word religion. Maybe it's because I've been raised a christian and I've always been taught that its a relationship with Jesus Christ, not a religion. But "religion" to me is all the do's and don'ts. Yeah Christianity is often seen as a list of "dos and donts" but it's all in how you take it.

But I certainly think one's beliefs affects the way a person behaves or acts. How can it not? If you truly have a belief or faith in something, of course you will attempt to live your life in a way that honors what you believe. Whether you are Jewish, Christian, Hindu etc...

But as Kiwi said, many times having a faith (and most often any faith associated with Christianity- myself included) can very easily have a very "holier then thou" attitude and can be very judgemental. I know I'm not holier then anyone else on this planet because a sin is a sin and all sin is equal, and since I am NOT perfect its nearly impossible NOT to judge.
 
Do you think religion is a good or bad thing, in general? Look at the things it fosters, such as relief organizations, compassion, hatred, death, war, etc. Is it more beneficial or harmful?
 
This is a tough one....... for some reason I find it easier to focus on the bad things done in the name of God and for a religion, not to mention the freaky pervs that are peppered throughout all religions..... I just don't know.
 
kiwi said:
I think that religion very much affects the way people behave. For example, things that others do regularly with no thought about, I think of as "mistakes" or "bad" things because of my religion and the way I've been taught. I believe that without religion the world would be worse, of course no one would hate others for their religions, but they would definitely hate them for other reasons.

Unfortunately religion also cause people to be judgemental, but that is a problem with being human, not with religion itself (unless that particular religion tells you to judge every one that's different from you).


You don't need religion to learn right from wrong, so not necessarily will the world be much worse off. Religion has caused many deaths, wars, and lots of suffering.
 
religion is, in one way or another, responsible for the majority of war, political, economic and commercial oppression. plus babylon just plain sucks.

i need to go eat dinner, maybe i'll continue when i get back. i was gonna respond to a few people.


edit> i like stirring people up :D
 
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Bubbles said:
You know Sarcasmo, you are now twice in one week discussing topics best left undiscussed. The three golden topics to avoid when in public conversation are politics, religion, and sports........you are a bad bad boy.


i would personally like to thank you for contributing to this thread
 
Bubbles said:
You know Sarcasmo, you are now twice in one week discussing topics best left undiscussed. The three golden topics to avoid when in public conversation are politics, religion, and sports........you are a bad bad boy.
Best avoided in all conversation. It's in poor taste and distinctly american. :rolleyes:
 
Bubbles said:
You know Sarcasmo, you are now twice in one week discussing topics best left undiscussed. The three golden topics to avoid when in public conversation are politics, religion, and sports........you are a bad bad boy.


Touchdown Jesus is gonna pwn Purdue and all the right wing voters!!!

GO CATHOLICS!!












Post meant in pure jest
 
Bubbles said:
You know Sarcasmo, you are now twice in one week discussing topics best left undiscussed. The three golden topics to avoid when in public conversation are politics, religion, and sports........you are a bad bad boy.


What else is there to talk about? Most things are so banal. I have to talk about things that stimulate me or I get grumpy.

I guess I'll go play some FIFA 2005.