Ontopic Illegal Immigration, How Do We Deal With It?

Mr. Asa said:
You are on a public forum. People are gonna say shit you don't like. Suck it up, buttercup.

The military is less than 1% of the population in this country. They also get housing, food, and medical paid for.
There are better targets for concern.
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well same can be said for you. still can't make me stop.
it was just one example.
 
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Puff Dabby said:
gonna be honest, dont know what that word means, looked it up on google and still not sure what your statement meant. I dumb dumb.
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You aren't allowed to believe your opinion is beyond questioning or criticism.

I'm allowed to believe the Earth is flat, but everyone else is allowed to call me out on how dumb that is.
 
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Maureen said:
Blame Mexico.
That's the answer to everything
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Mr. Asa said:
The lack of a living wage causes the govt to pay stupid amounts of money to people that they shouldn't have to.
Create a living wage and two things will happen. The cost of those programs will drop, and every Republican will start screaming about the military getting paid as much as a burger flipper and their wages will increase using those same tax dollars that paid for the aid programs..
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Money doesn't just come out of thin air. Since increasing the wages for employment will come out of the pockets of the businesses, one of two things will happen to offset those costs.

1) The cost of goods and services will increase to offset the new (in some cases, close to double) wages for the same employee doing the same work. That means that the money people are making in the middle class, is actually worth less. So their wages go up. They drive the market for pretty much everything that's purchased in the US, so now they pay more for the same product, which means the people making that $15/hour are now also paying more for the same things they were before and they STILL can't afford the things they want or need.

2) The businesses will strive to be a "low price leader", so they'll retain their current prices on products. But they're not going to sacrifice revenue for being a good Samaritan. So lets say they have ten employees making $10/hour. setting aside all other overhead and assumed costs (i.e. healthcare, paid sick leave accruals etc) 10 employees making $10/hour means $100/hour total. Now all of a sudden that $10/hour is increased to $15/hour. The total cost per hour is now $150. But to keep the prices low, they have to get that cost back down to as close to $100/hour as they can. How? Require less people to do more work. Lets cut that back to 7 positions instead of ten. It's now down to $105/hour, and 7 out of 10 people are making livable wages. But what about the other three?

The point is, businesses are out to make money, and when you force them to increase their overhead costs per employee, they're going to figure out some way to offset those costs. Usually at the expense of the employee. So does it really help those living in poverty when in this example, you increase the wages of 7 people but put the other 3 out of work completely?
 
thintoast said:
Money doesn't just come out of thin air. Since increasing the wages for employment will come out of the pockets of the businesses, one of two things will happen to offset those costs.

1) The cost of goods and services will increase to offset the new (in some cases, close to double) wages for the same employee doing the same work. That means that the money people are making in the middle class, is actually worth less. So their wages go up. They drive the market for pretty much everything that's purchased in the US, so now they pay more for the same product, which means the people making that $15/hour are now also paying more for the same things they were before and they STILL can't afford the things they want or need.

2) The businesses will strive to be a "low price leader", so they'll retain their current prices on products. But they're not going to sacrifice revenue for being a good Samaritan. So lets say they have ten employees making $10/hour. setting aside all other overhead and assumed costs (i.e. healthcare, paid sick leave accruals etc) 10 employees making $10/hour means $100/hour total. Now all of a sudden that $10/hour is increased to $15/hour. The total cost per hour is now $150. But to keep the prices low, they have to get that cost back down to as close to $100/hour as they can. How? Require less people to do more work. Lets cut that back to 7 positions instead of ten. It's now down to $105/hour, and 7 out of 10 people are making livable wages. But what about the other three?

The point is, businesses are out to make money, and when you force them to increase their overhead costs per employee, they're going to figure out some way to offset those costs. Usually at the expense of the employee. So does it really help those living in poverty when in this example, you increase the wages of 7 people but put the other 3 out of work completely?
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You need to take Macroeconomics 102 to follow up your 101 opinions.

Without forcing livable wages, the burden falls back to social safety nets, driving up the cost of government to those who pay taxes. Walmart costs the taxpayers $6.2B/yr in various welfare programs because they pay their employees so poorly.
 
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thintoast said:
With their squinty eyes and sh

Sooo... by raising minimum wage, there's no extra costs to offset? The company will just take the bite out of their profits and say, welp, that's life..."?
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The costs are offset by taxpayers, dummy. The workers have to live, regardless of whether their means to live comes from wages or from taxpayers.

Walmart workers cost taxpayers $6.2B in public assistance. Given that their annual profit is $129.9B, I don't think it's swinging things to quite the extreme you suggest that *any* tampering with minimum wage will cause.
 
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