hellllooooo recession

In a way, you could see this coming back when the Tech Bubble started it's fluctuating. This credit thing has been a long time coming, and by no surprise. Trying to base economic gains and movement on money that people don't have but will need to pay back is a poor way to keep the money flowing through the system, and is destined to have an endpoint when the credit being pushed out can't be supported anymore by those it's being pushed to.

The writing on the wall for this was actually out there more than 3 years ago, right before the housing bubble burst. Just like techs, people had to realise that the housing buying spree couldn't be supported (just like the PC buying spree of the late 90's couldn't continue either), but no one paid attention to that fact, and instead kept hopping on, hoping they weren't too late to cash in like everyone else.

The difference between the tech bubble burst before and when the housing bubble burst is the fact that with Tech, it affected company infrastructures, some stocks, and jobs, but, really, wasn't anything that was at the core of most american's wealth.

Houseing, however, was. It was a direct hit on the foundation of 90% of middle america's saved funds, which is equity. The increase in home prices had, incorrectly, become the primary foundation of which most of america was basing their largest source of retirement income. When that burst, most of america took a big freakin kick to the nuts, and many people panicked in the thought that what they thought they had saved for their retirement was now gone.

Part of the issue is people don't pay attention ENOUGH to the news. Sure, they may listen to it, and say 'OMG, thats bad', but they don't file it away in their brains, and start using all of the daily input to look for the longterm trends, and this is how everything gets fucked up.

I could go off for pages on this, but I'll keep it short to say that really, I'm hoping this recession teaches a lesson to people that it's time to be much more aware of the world around you. Keeping a 'situational awareness' of the economy and events around, and then using your brains and your voice to influence how it affects you, is the only true way control how badly these events hit you.

PIPE DOWN YOU BLEEDING HEART DEMOCRAT
SPEND SPEND SPEND


:p
 
So who here watched Greenspan's report to Congress yesterday? Anybody?

Here's the cliffs:

AG: Hey guys, turns out that banks can't self regulate in a free market...I guess people turned out to be greedy after all. I guess we need to turn towards a more socialist system. Sorry about the last 20 years, my bad. Oh yeah, a world recession might be on the way, heads up guys.


Which, imo, should be the last nail in McCain's coffin.
 
PIPE DOWN YOU BLEEDING HEART DEMOCRAT
SPEND SPEND SPEND


:p

Funny thing is, until recently, I was a registered republican.

I'm now officially an independant.

I don't believe in many of the social welfare programs of the democrats, but I also believe that you can't have people be self sufficient if you straight up won't educate them or give them the opportunities to do so.

Right now, I view the republican mindset as being a selfish 'Rich get richer' version of what it once was. The republicans can get us back on track by pushing for huge increases in funds for education, more money for small business loans, and less money for overseas military operations. Those three things would make me start believing in the party again.

Also, rampant spending is bad. Managed savings is good. Living paycheck to paycheck is asking for nightmares when things go bad.
 
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Funny thing is, until recently, I was a registered republican.

I'm now officially an independant.

I don't believe in many of the social welfare programs of the democrats, but I also believe that you can't have people be self sufficient if you straight up won't educate them or give them the opportunities to do so.

Right now, I view the republican mindset as being a selfish 'Rich get richer' version of what it once was. The republicans can get us back on track by pushing for huge increases in funds for education, more money for small business loans, and less money for overseas military operations. Those three things would make me start believing in the party again.

Also, rampant spending is bad. Managed savings is good. Living paycheck to paycheck is asking for nightmares when things go bad.

it's really astounding how both parties have fiscally done a 180...the reps used to be all about running a lean govt and banking cash while the opposite was true of the dems...they have completely reversed things now and it seems very few have noticed...it's quite bizarre
 
it's really astounding how both parties have fiscally done a 180...the reps used to be all about running a lean govt and banking cash while the opposite was true of the dems...they have completely reversed things now and it seems very few have noticed...it's quite bizarre

I think it's because the republicans realized that their ability to generate fast wealth was going to be generated by those with less money buying bigger ticket items on more credit instead of saving and waiting. The 'Free Market' push involved pushing more money through the system, and keeping it revolving and flowing until it could eventually be captured by those at the top.

I think the democrats have realized that their socialistic views will only work with a stronger financial base amongst the masses, meaning more liquid capital stored than being spent, and closing down the rampant consumerism that started off the entire mess back in the 80s.


It really doesn't surprise me that both parties moved in the directions they did. Overall, their viewpoints on the economy support their primary views.
 
Yea, can't feel bad about what they are paying in gas when they have those kinds of cars at all. If they are going to buy those types of vehicles they just need to expect high gas prices and deal with it or buy smarter vehicles.

His sister actually bought it for him. She sold a business for a couple of billion dollars and bought him the car.

The company picks up all of his expenses and pays the leases for his "everyday" cars so the only reason they complain is when their bonusus are less than $50k :fly:
 
Well I'm stuck in this crunch. I was living in Florida, as many of you know, and had to suddenly move back to Michigan. My mother attempted to commit suicide as my parents got a divorce all while my sister got in a bad horse accident all in about a 7 month span. As such I gave up some things and gained others:

I had to leave a manager position with a restaurant to return home to a bartending/waiting tables gig. I ended up being able to save more, for obvious reasons, and then when my roomie go back from China we got an apartment. I'm in Michigan and the economy is bad. I don't make a lot of money but everything from rent to food is cheaper here. I only pay more for smokes. So while being caught up in this economic crunch I've found a very interesting and totally unexpected point of view.

All that this economic crunch has done is give me a more global understanding of how the world works now. understand past historical events show that politics effected economies; think France and England in the 1400s. Now economies change politics; think Oil and war... So all that training hasn’t given a formula for current understanding of trends, yet it has given a few keys to understanding the concepts behind the events.

So with the current trend instead of traditional effects it’s going to be a realization of the global effect. The world isn’t isolationist any longer it’s very much a flat world. Not via politics but via economics. The economies will continue to fall and build in rapid changing fashions as the new-born global economy reaches it equilibrium. It’s a hard time but it will end up well enough (or so I hope). The economy can’t rebuild to what we wish or have seen in the past but it can move forward. This is just a re-wording of past historical trends.

I should use some specific examples to support my arguments but this isn’t a thesis I’m just rambling.
 
I think the economy's pretty bad and all, but the fact that oil is going down in price must be a good thing. Atleast people will stop bitching about the price of petrol. I think even if there is a 'recession' it's probably a good thing. People are stupid and ignorant and even now they're not changing their lives and adapting to having less money particularly, they just keep bitching expecting the world to change around them. The reason I couldn't care less about the "global recession" is that I'm not a stupid person who uses energy unnecessarily and thinks it should be a human right to consume as much as possible. I know I can live on pretty much no money at all because I have done in the past, call me selfish and all but I think humanity needs a big kick up the ass.
 
Well I'm stuck in this crunch. I was living in Florida, as many of you know, and had to suddenly move back to Michigan. My mother attempted to commit suicide as my parents got a divorce all while my sister got in a bad horse accident all in about a 7 month span. As such I gave up some things and gained others:

I had to leave a manager position with a restaurant to return home to a bartending/waiting tables gig. I ended up being able to save more, for obvious reasons, and then when my roomie go back from China we got an apartment. I'm in Michigan and the economy is bad. I don't make a lot of money but everything from rent to food is cheaper here. I only pay more for smokes. So while being caught up in this economic crunch I've found a very interesting and totally unexpected point of view.

All that this economic crunch has done is give me a more global understanding of how the world works now. understand past historical events show that politics effected economies; think France and England in the 1400s. Now economies change politics; think Oil and war... So all that training hasn’t given a formula for current understanding of trends, yet it has given a few keys to understanding the concepts behind the events.

So with the current trend instead of traditional effects it’s going to be a realization of the global effect. The world isn’t isolationist any longer it’s very much a flat world. Not via politics but via economics. The economies will continue to fall and build in rapid changing fashions as the new-born global economy reaches it equilibrium. It’s a hard time but it will end up well enough (or so I hope). The economy can’t rebuild to what we wish or have seen in the past but it can move forward. This is just a re-wording of past historical trends.


I should use some specific examples to support my arguments but this isn’t a thesis I’m just rambling.

:heart: for you and your family. :(
 
djduquet presents a good point about one of the drawbacks of the massive globalization we've seen in just the past 20 years. We either help the weaker ones keep from collapsing or risk them eventually pulling us down some too.

Oil prices will probably go back up after the election.