Thread Depression: By the numbers...

SemperFly said:
That I generally agree on even though part of it is giving the republicans everything they want. But it's patently dishonest of you to bring up things that were caused by the previous administration and then put an image down there implying the blame lies with obama. Any president would have had these problems. There are no policies that could have been enacted that would have solved the problems you listed in three years.

Try to get this through your head: trickle down economics is a lie.
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Getting rid of Baseline Budgeting would be a good first step.

Cutting government spending by even by 1% across the board would another good step.
 
Arátoeldar said:
Getting rid of Baseline Budgeting would be a good first step.

Cutting government spending by even by 1% across the board would another good step.
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It would be a step but it wouldn't necessarily be a good one.

This "across the board" shit is absurd. That's nothing more than political posturing; simply cutting across the board completely ignores the fact that some services are more essential than others as well as ignores the very issue of waste and budgeting problems. You think that the 1% is going to come from the waste? Fuck no. You examine the biggest chunks - which as far as discretionary spending goes is the 1.4 trillion dollars a year spent in so-called "defense" - to stop the hemorrhaging first but you do so in a calculated manner. You figure out what you need and what you don't then you trim, you don't simply say "cut across the board" and pretend like it's going to do anything. Once you've dealt with the larger problem then you worry about utterly ridiculous stuff like NPR and planned parenthood which saves virtually nothing.

And while you're doing this you increase revenues by ending tax breaks and loopholes for the wealthiest citizens and their corporations. Because the idea that they're suffering "job creators" and will create less jobs if we tax them higher is nothing more than a blatant, bald-faced lie. Supply-side economics is a lie. It always has been and always will be. Increasing taxes does not kill jobs, what it does it help pull our economy out of the gutter that the past ten years helped drive us deeper into.
 
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ZRH said:
Dude... Cmon, only crazies worry about gold backed currency.

Funny thing, I was reading Ford speeches, trying to remember why we had recession when he was president and I found this excerpt in one of them. This is Gerald Ford on October 8, 1974
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It's not crazy. A commodity based currency would go a long way towards fixing some of the major problems with this country. Things like gigantic boom-bust cycles, out of control spending, and the endless wars.
 
fly said:
It's not crazy. A commodity based currency would go a long way towards fixing some of the major problems with this country. Things like gigantic boom-bust cycles, out of control spending, and the endless wars.
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Anything can be devalued. Gold has no inherent value other than what someone is willing to pay for it. That is basically the same way fiat currency works except about 4 times a year someone decides the relative amount of money there should be in circulation, vs how much gold there is in existence and the demand for it driving the 'value'. What you want is a fixed money supply, and that is never going to happen because interventionist economics is how governments operate.
 
gonna laugh when in twenty years chemists are able to make artificial gold at a lower price than real gold and the gold lovers shit their pants
 
ZRH said:
Anything can be devalued. Gold has no inherent value other than what someone is willing to pay for it. That is basically the same way fiat currency works except about 4 times a year someone decides the relative amount of money there should be in circulation, vs how much gold there is in existence and the demand for it driving the 'value'. What you want is a fixed money supply, and that is never going to happen because interventionist economics is how governments operate.
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I'm not asking for a gold backed currency, although that is a step in the right direction. I'm talking actual gold, which IS somewhat limited.

Or maybe bitcoins...
 
Great day today. Watched a couple soccer games, worked out a bunch, hit the park and chatted up a cute chick with a dog. Started the day at about a 5, finished up around a 9.3 or 9.4.
 
fly said:
I'm not asking for a gold backed currency, although that is a step in the right direction. I'm talking actual gold, which IS somewhat limited.

Or maybe bitcoins...
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The price is still determined by supply and demand. Right now gold is worth a lot because it is the traditional 'safe' investment. In 1999-2002 the price of gold was about 200oz (1700ish per oz now). It is 'in demand.' You could use cows as a commodity currency and get the same effect, demand for beef/dairy would effect the relative price.

Bitcoins are interesting but not much else. I can't wait until the IRS decides to go after them, barter/trade income IS taxable, read IRS Publication 525.
 
ZRH said:
The price is still determined by supply and demand. Right now gold is worth a lot because it is the traditional 'safe' investment. In 1999-2002 the price of gold was about 200oz (1700ish per oz now). It is 'in demand.' You could use cows as a commodity currency and get the same effect, demand for beef/dairy would effect the relative price.

Bitcoins are interesting but not much else. I can't wait until the IRS decides to go after them, barter/trade income IS taxable, read IRS Publication 525.
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I'm not saying the "value" as compared to other things won't change. Of course it will. The difference is that its set "just right" by the market, not artificially high or low by some suit in Washington.
 
fly said:
I'm not saying the "value" as compared to other things won't change. Of course it will. The difference is that its set "just right" by the market, not artificially high or low by some suit in Washington.
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Stock prices are set 'just right' by the market... :fly:
 
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