WTF Bad boys, Bad boys, whatcha gonna do

HipHugHer

Looks like Ted Nugent, Smells like Sasquatch
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But was anyone shot by the cops in Denver that day? And how many interactions did the cops have that day?
Nationally 50,000,000+ interactions with cops / year. Something around 1000 deaths / year, the majority of which had it coming.
 

HipHugHer

Looks like Ted Nugent, Smells like Sasquatch
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So, 1:50k?
Some did, but way too many didn't.
Just the numbers.
The majority being legit doesn't make the ones that aren't any less bad.

It goes to show that despite their claims, being a cop is really not that dangerous a job. Most go through an entire career without shooting someone or getting shot at.

Also goes to show that despite some other folks claims, they're not some brotherhood of bloodthirsty killers either.
 

Domon

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May 19, 2011
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Nationally 50,000,000+ interactions with cops / year. Something around 1000 deaths / year, the majority of which had it coming.
1000 reported deaths. They only show up when they get caught.

The Breonna Taylor police report reported no injuries.
 

wetwille

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Just the numbers.
The majority being legit doesn't make the ones that aren't any less bad.

It goes to show that despite their claims, being a cop is really not that dangerous a job. Most go through an entire career without shooting someone or getting shot at.

Also goes to show that despite some other folks claims, they're not some brotherhood of bloodthirsty killers either.
I agree except the "they're not some brotherhood of bloodthirsty killers either". The one's that are, ARE bloodthirsty, head-busters. It's maybe 5-8% (plucked from air). I don't think we need to get rid of the police but the institution needs a major overhaul. And the public needs public service announcements giving them instruction and perspective on how to interact with a LEO so nobody gets tense. "I pay your salary" doesn't fly.
 

Domon

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I agree except the "they're not some brotherhood of bloodthirsty killers either". The one's that are, ARE bloodthirsty, head-busters. It's maybe 5-8% (plucked from air). I don't think we need to get rid of the police but the institution needs a major overhaul. And the public needs public service announcements giving them instruction and perspective on how to interact with a LEO so nobody gets tense. "I pay your salary" doesn't fly.
5-8% of your profession being murderous is an insane amount.

And the argument against the other 92% is that theyre complicit because they protect those 5-8%, even if they dont do bad shit themselves, observing it and not standing out against it (either out of personal fear for safety, job security, or out of apathy) is also a systemic problem.
 
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wetwille

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5-8% of your profession being murderous is an insane amount.

And the argument against the other 92% is that theyre complicit because they protect those 5-8%, even if they dont do bad shit themselves, observing it and not standing out against it (either out of personal fear for safety, job security, or out of apathy) is also a systemic problem.
I'm assuming the public is no more than 1-2% below those numbers I plucked. Considering how many murders they commit each year. I agree it's systemic, so why blame those who can't fight it? You've admitted there are systems in place that preclude it.

Reinoehl:
Arrested in June going 111mph with his 11 year old (and a cat and a large dog) in the car, weed, pills, unregistered, loaded gun. And under the influence.
July - arrested with an unregistered firearm, etc.
Admits, on-air, that he shot someone. Obviously a solid citizen.
Not saying he deserved for it to go down that way, legally. Really sounds like he was coming mentally unglued.
Still, stupid games -> stupid prizes.
 

Domon

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I'm assuming the public is no more than 1-2% below those numbers I plucked. Considering how many murders they commit each year. I agree it's systemic, so why blame those who can't fight it? You've admitted there are systems in place that preclude it.

Reinoehl:
Arrested in June going 111mph with his 11 year old (and a cat and a large dog) in the car, weed, pills, unregistered, loaded gun. And under the influence.
July - arrested with an unregistered firearm, etc.
Admits, on-air, that he shot someone. Obviously a solid citizen.
Not saying he deserved for it to go down that way, legally. Really sounds like he was coming mentally unglued.
Still, stupid games -> stupid prizes.
and thats precisely the false argument police trainers make. The general public is nowhere near that.

Violent crime rate is 381 per 100,000. Thats .3%. Not 3%, one third of a percent

The highest rate ever in the US of violent crime was .7%

citation: https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...n-america-violent-crime-murder-rate/40968963/

And thats assuming each of those violent crimes was committed by a unique individual. The percentage goes way down if multiple crimes are commited per felon.
 

HipHugHer

Looks like Ted Nugent, Smells like Sasquatch
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I agree except the "they're not some brotherhood of bloodthirsty killers either". The one's that are, ARE bloodthirsty, head-busters. It's maybe 5-8% (plucked from air). I don't think we need to get rid of the police but the institution needs a major overhaul. And the public needs public service announcements giving them instruction and perspective on how to interact with a LEO so nobody gets tense. "I pay your salary" doesn't fly.
Most the ones that do these bad/unjustified shootings already have a bunch of complaints for excessive force or other bad behavior, etc.
Just the department's write it off as nothing or at most get a sternly worded letter.
That's the stuff that needs to be public, not just internal to the dept. Would hold them more accountable to us and run those guys off the job, and make it so they can just go to another dept. and get hired without them knowing their history.
 
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wetwille

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and thats precisely the false argument police trainers make. The general public is nowhere near that.

Violent crime rate is 381 per 100,000. Thats .3%. Not 3%, one third of a percent

The highest rate ever in the US of violent crime was .7%

citation: https://www.usatoday.com/story/mone...n-america-violent-crime-murder-rate/40968963/

And thats assuming each of those violent crimes was committed by a unique individual. The percentage goes way down if multiple crimes are commited per felon.
I agree that it's probably the same cops doing it over and over. My percentage would then fall greatly.
So . . . There are 800k cops nationwide, and they kill 1000/yr.
800k citizens experience 3048 violent crimes by your numbers. Or roughly 1.25 million violent crimes for the whole USA. But yes, probably 1000-2000 of those were perpetrated by cops.
 

Domon

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Most the ones that do these bad/unjustified shootings already have a bunch of complaints for excessive force or other bad behavior, etc.
Just the department's write it off as nothing or at most get a sternly worded letter.
That's the stuff that needs to be public, not just internal to the dept. Would hold them more accountable to us and run those guys off the job, and make it so they can just go to another dept. and get hired without them knowing their history.
So precisely this scenario. The police union for the NYPD (but not just the nypd, all over the place this happens), utilized a small portion of a civil rights law to prevent anyone, including oversight, state and local lawmakers, and independent judiciary boards from seeing police misconduct records. They were only overruled after 30 years of doing this a month ago. Noone could see how bad the police were, except the police.

 

Domon

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I agree that it's probably the same cops doing it over and over. My percentage would then fall greatly.
So . . . There are 800k cops nationwide, and they kill 1000/yr.
800k citizens experience 3048 violent crimes by your numbers. Or roughly 1.25 million violent crimes for the whole USA. But yes, probably 1000-2000 of those were perpetrated by cops.
Gotta look at it as a per capita per population percentage to have the statistical significance align.

There are 686,665 police officers in the US (federal, local, sheriffs, etc).

1004 murders out of 686664 is 146 per 100,000.

The civilian stats we've been talking are violent crime though, not murder.

The US homicide rate per 100,000 is 4.96 in the civilian population.

Cops kill people 36x as often as civilians.


edit: bad data.... my rate of 16.3 per capita was for ALL OF THE AMERICAS, including the entirety of south america, which is the highesti nthe world. The actual rate for the US alone is 4.96 per 100,000.
 
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wetwille

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Gotta look at it as a per capita per population percentage to have the statistical significance align.

There are 686,665 police officers in the US (federal, local, sheriffs, etc).

1004 murders out of 686664 is 146 per 100,000.

The civilian stats we've been talking are violent crime though, not murder.

The US homicide rate per 100,000 is 4.96 in the civilian population.

Cops kill people 36x as often as civilians.


edit: bad data.... my rate of 16.3 per capita was for ALL OF THE AMERICAS, including the entirety of south america, which is the highesti nthe world. The actual rate for the US alone is 4.96 per 100,000.
You're comparing the overall population to a limited sub-set. Give it up. Or let me know when your data is stabilized.