9/11 - Building 7, The Real Truth

Sarcasmo

A Taste Of Honey Fluff Boy
Mar 28, 2005
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Also, I can still own almost any gun I choose and say pretty much anything I want in protest of whatever I want. Do you have specific examples of your claims?
 

Sarcasmo

A Taste Of Honey Fluff Boy
Mar 28, 2005
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NSA, FBI, CIA, DEA, and any of the law enforcement agencies have benefited and some of the executive branch.

You realize that all of those agencies are still bound by the federal rules of evidence, the federal rules of procedure, and due process? Nothing has changed except a few methods of gathering that evidence. People are just afraid it has.
 

b_sinning

Erect Member
Nov 22, 2004
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There are tons of examples of abuse. Just google it or read almost any real newspaper.

http://action.aclu.org/reformthepatriotact/facts.html#abuses


People vanish into the system all of the time and some go years without any due process.

I'm not going to debate it because people will believe what they believe until they choose to see differently. That is their right and if it make some one feel more secure to believe in the tooth fairy then good luck to that person. I have seen cops abuse power first hand and seen them go unpunished even when caught. The more power the more chance of abuse. I hope if I'm ever in a bad situation I will be proved wrong but I'm not holding my breath.
 
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Sarcasmo

A Taste Of Honey Fluff Boy
Mar 28, 2005
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People don't 'vanish' into the system all the time. Show me a news story that investigates the whereabouts of someone's husband after he was arrested by cops or agents. Some do go years without due process, but that isn't related to 9/11, it's related to the bottlenecked clusterfuck of our judicial system. The abuse of power by a policeman or federal agent isn't related to 9/11 either. It's related to being human. There may have been a rise in that abuse of power following the enacting of certain post-9/11 legislation, but it isn't out of control and the courts typically make short work of those perpetrators when lawsuits are brought.

I guess I see it differently than you because I worked for years in the federal courts and witnessed firsthand many of the instances that you are trying to describe. I now work in private civil law and see them from the opposite side. Either way I've seen nothing whatsoever to indicate any massive conspiracy or tyrannical betrayal of the public. I have, however, seen a few dickheads who eventually get screwed by the system they tried to manipulate for their gain.

The American layman consistently underestimates how many of this nation's principles are safeguarded by case law and the checks and balances system.
 
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fly

Osharts 11
Oct 1, 2004
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You realize that all of those agencies are still bound by the federal rules of evidence, the federal rules of procedure, and due process? Nothing has changed except a few methods of gathering that evidence. People are just afraid it has.

Do you really believe that our government is really playing by the rules simply for the greater good?
 

Sarcasmo

A Taste Of Honey Fluff Boy
Mar 28, 2005
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Do you really believe that our government is really playing by the rules simply for the greater good?

Of course they are. See, our government is us. If you want to meet genuine lay people, go to any state or federal office.
 

Floptical

Doesnt Read Thread Titles
Sep 1, 2006
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Do you really believe that our government is really playing by the rules simply for the greater good?

Of course they are. If the American public knew only a tiny portion of the things These agencies do everyday to protect us they would shut their mouths. So much stuff is done that people do not and should not know about. There is a special breed of people who can sleep at night doing what has to be done and ending up with blood on their hands and as a whole most Americans can't.
 

fly

Osharts 11
Oct 1, 2004
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Of course they are. If the American public knew only a tiny portion of the things These agencies do everyday to protect us they would shut their mouths. So much stuff is done that people do not and should not know about. There is a special breed of people who can sleep at night doing what has to be done and ending up with blood on their hands and as a whole most Americans can't.

Bullshit, I don't buy it. A true patriot is a rare commodity these days, most don't see past their own fat waistlines. You really think *they* had this country in mind when we invaded Iraq?
 

Sarcasmo

A Taste Of Honey Fluff Boy
Mar 28, 2005
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They as in the administration? The general public? The military? Don't blame the many for the actions of the few.
 

b_sinning

Erect Member
Nov 22, 2004
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The war has made people rich, given a questionable president a second term, and has give the general public a reason to get behind the government.
 

Sarcasmo

A Taste Of Honey Fluff Boy
Mar 28, 2005
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Yes but are those reasons to suspect conspiracy? The product of this great mystery has been questionable at best. I see no real reason for a dog and pony show of this scale to accomplish so relatively little. It just doesn't make sense. The rich people aren't THAT rich, and the people aren't THAT behind the government. And of course other presidents achieved second terms without being responsible for the deaths of thousands of their own people.
 

JAXvillain

Curly_Sue
Oct 13, 2004
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Of course they are. If the American public knew only a tiny portion of the things These agencies do everyday to protect us they would shut their mouths. So much stuff is done that people do not and should not know about. There is a special breed of people who can sleep at night doing what has to be done and ending up with blood on their hands and as a whole most Americans can't.

hail to thee mr blackwater contractor /real american hero commercial
 

ZRH

(retired?) Google-F.U.
Mar 5, 2005
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b_sinning said:
NSA, FBI, CIA, DEA, and any of the law enforcement agencies have benefited and some of the executive branch.
Why do you think of them as some sort of independent entities with their own goals? The vast majority of the 'government' is made up of 9-5 office jobs who dont get paid anything that could be called 'competitive'.

What does even getting power give them? They cant change how they get paid, and money is about the only reason to go for power in the US. For example, the NSA has a SUPER scary name, and no one REALLY knows they do exactly, but it doesnt take much digging to figure out they are mostly marginally paid PHDs who couldnt or didnt want to do university research or teach.

All organizations are made up of people. People are good, bad and ugly, and they all work with you. Every group of people I've ever seen, worked with, or read about, acts exactly like they did in HS. People, are people are people. You are the government.

Fact is all these people who benefitted from the war wouldve benefitted from something else if there wasnt one. The only thing that 9/11 did was destroy some very valuable real estate and shake the economy pretty bad.

It hasnt played well for anyone and stereotyping everyone who doesnt agree with you as teh evil profiteering warmongers is just childish. Advancing conspiracy for the sake of novelty is played out and boring. Especially when the so called evidence is so weak and the theories so far fetched.
 

ZRH

(retired?) Google-F.U.
Mar 5, 2005
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*badly.

Now what were you saying?

Oh snap, I mess up ONCE.

I think it was pretty clear what I was saying or I wouldnt have bothered to say it o_O

The first thing I was saying was that y'all suck at logic.
 
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